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Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby pHISTERmILL » Sun Jan 03, 2010 12:00 am

Have been searching but never found a sequencer like the Creator/Notator that works on the PC instead of Atari.
Am still using Atari and cReator for serious music arrangement and composing, but it's just a matter of time til my current hardware will fail and it's getting harder every year to get functioning Ataris.
So, has anyone seen or heard of a PC sequencer that works like Creator - that is more in pattern/part mode and not liear like all current software of today?
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby Atari Music Network » Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:03 am

Hi pHISTERmILL,

From my experience using both PC and Atari, there really isn't anything for PC similar to Notator unless you want to use an ancient PC version of Logic or Cubase Score. However, keep in mind that the stability of the MIDI clock could be jittery on the PC.

More importantly, you bring up an excellent point about Atari computers slowly breaking down and becoming ever more rare. As an Atari Falcon based musician, I was forced by necessity to learn how to solder, hack, mod, and tweak my machines to keep them in top shape. I avoided having to learn these skills until everything stopped working and I was forced to make a choice - switch to PC/MAC or learn to fix these beautiful machines and keep going until I die (I'm only 30 years old btw). Obviously, I chose the latter! ;)

My point is, don't give up. For every broken Atari, someone out there knows the solution. As an Atarian in 2010, we have to learn how to fix it or at least take the time to do it if we know how to already....
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby exxosuk » Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:49 pm

Hi pHISTERmILL,
AMN is right, there really is nothing like Creator/Notatotor (which I use myself and love to bits) for the PC. The 'nearest' (if that's the right word) equivalant is Logic, which is a (ahem) 'development' :cry: of Notator. Personally I think it's a retrograde step! Anyway, you'll find quite a few Notator style sections in Logic, but overall there's far too much going on than you actually NEED to work with in Logic, whilst Notator has the perfect combination of comprehensivity (again if that's the right phrase :shock: ) and accessibility.
I wouldn't worry too much about Ataris. There are still a whole bunch of them out there, and I've been GIVEN systems in the last few years, so I've got a stock of jealously guarded machines and other bits. I could run 2 of them at the same time running Notator and 192 MIDI channels (BLISS!! :D ) but at present I can't find the room - ! live in hope....
Check Ebay worldwide for Atari stuff. Here in the UK there's a reasonbale amount of stuff available, while Ebay.de seems to have a healthy supply, and most of the folks there are ready and willing to send abroad.
My own fave guy here in the UK is Keychange Music Services (www.keychange.co.uk) who has EVERYTHING you could think of for Ataris and does repairs,servicing and upgrades -usual disclaimer here apart from the fact that he keeps me going!
And he does send stuff worldwide.
I think we need to be aware of the fact that the Atari community is now like a vintage/classic car club, where we keep our babies going with DIY servicing, cannibalisation and cottage industry suppliers. It may be a little more difficult than going to 'PCs 'R' us' (mind you , is anybody still running 286 PCs?) but it's not impossible and I fully expect my machines to be humming long after I'm gone.
Don't despair and keep the faith -we can and will continue with our old outdated but CLASSIC technology.

Best wishes,
Dave.
:D
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby Atari Music Network » Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:29 pm

Great insight! I love the analogy of the "classic car club"...

Speaking of Ebay worldwide, if you haven't noticed yet, there is a lovely menu right above you, "ATARI ON EBAY" that searches Ebay worldwide for you! ;) Personally, I prefer using craigslist because it's local and you can barter people down.
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby pHISTERmILL » Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:33 pm

Hi Folks!

First of all, great forum idea! 8-)

Back on topic: wouldn't agree that Logic is that much more near Creator/Notator (here after C/N) than any other linear sequencer on the market. The special thing about C/N is the pattern-based structure in which you build a song. THAT is the geniality of it! I can't imagine why noone would implement that idea into a PC software instead of just putting out another Cubase-clone - which works great for audio but lacks the direct and intuitive arranging possibilties you get in C/N. The closest I've seen today is Ableton Live and an old program called Sweet16.
About MIDI-timing on the PC: I can't say that PC today lacks good and stable timing. That is not an issue today. It works great.

On hardware: been thru two STe's and one STfm, and on my third STe now with harddrive (MEGA?) And it still runs Creator as my main composing and arranging tool! :D
But it also means a workaround when someone brings midi-files to the studio ... on a USB or by mail. Would be nice to have one platform.

/ChEErs!
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby exxosuk » Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:44 pm

Hi again pHISTERmILL,
thanks for the reply.
I know what you mean about Logic and Notator not being that related, but Logic was developed from Notator (even down to calling it Notator Logic in the early days) and you'll find -at least on the Atari version- a lot of the same fonts, printer dapatations and the score stuff.
It's a pity they had to add that nonsensical front end which I reckon they pinched from Cubase :shock: :x :twisted: :|
As a result, with that * toolbox, it takes three operations to do something that Notator does in one -note editing is just one example: throw the note you don't want off the screen, or with the 'new, improved' Logic: find the toolbox, select rubber, click on rubber, click on note, slect toolbox, click on pointer, do not pass go, do not collect $200, etc, etc. :ugeek:
For MIDIfiles, I simply use a Smartdisk USB floppy drive connected to my Mac G5, and I've got a USB hub for anyone with USB sticks. Simply format the floppy with DOS on the Atari (to be sure), pop it in the Smartdisk drive, and copy MIDIfiles and anything else straight across.
With MegaSTEs you can use Ethernet - I think they've got a connection, and third party folks have come up with Ethernet connectors for ST/Es

Best wishes,

David.
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby Atari Music Network » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:05 am

Hey David, you say you've got two Atari ST's connected together running Notator? I think you've got yourself an Atari Frankenstein Monster Mod on your hands. <cough cough>

http://www.atarimusic.net/index.php/featured-articles/atari-hardware/hacks-and-mods/frankenstein-hacks-and-mods

pHISTERmILL/David: I'm wondering if we should petition the authors of STeem (the only MIDI capable PC Atari Emulator) to add connectivity with modern MIDI breakout boxes by bridging and emulating the original external hardware add-ons for Notator and Cubase (Unitor, Expander, MO4, etc.) How would you pose such a question to them? I'm a but fuzzy as to how I'd formulate the question.
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby exxosuk » Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:20 am

Hi AMN,
no, I haven't got my own Frankenstein monster of a setup (yet :lol: ).
I do have all the hardware for 2 STEs, each with Log 3 and Unitor, and they can be linked together, one acting as slave to the other. My problem is lack of shelf space for 2 plus PC monitors and all the connectors. However, I live in hope of something on this line:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1996_ar ... hulze.html

(read down for FIVE Ataris and 290 MIDI channels! :o :ugeek: )

I'm not sure that the warm and wonderful folks at STEEM would be up to or even able to emulate Unitor, Log 3 and MIDEX, as all these guys have built in dongles and the MIDI buss routing is inherent in the program. I think you'd need to give them details of the MIDI routing on the originals and ask them if they could do the same.
I wouldn't hold my breath though, nice though it would be if they managed it!

Best wishes,
Dave.
:D
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby pHISTERmILL » Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:52 am

detheridge wrote:the 'new, improved' Logic: find the toolbox, select rubber, click on rubber, click on note, select toolbox, click on pointer, do not pass go, do not collect $200, etc, etc.

Hahahaha! :lol:
That's development!
Yes, I know Logic is the great grandchild of Notator. ;)

AMN: I'm more in line to suggest writing a program directly for the PC (or Mac or Linux) that works as great as C/N on tha Atari, also with the ability to take on audio loops and audio recording. That would be a great music tool imo! Haven't got the slightest ability to program myself so... need to find a geek! :geek:
The sTEem-thing is fun, but I think it will never be able to work that efficient as to replacing the original hardware.
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby Waxjoz » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:27 pm

Just my two cents because I've always been a Cubase user. :)

Roni's Sweet Sixteen was an imitation of Notator and was ported to PC. I've seen it somewhere on the web.

If you like pattern based sequencers maybe you can check out FLStudio or Ableton Live.

Or use a tracker? Maybe I'm totally wrong because I've never really worked with Notator (I do have a dongled version though with manual),
but Notation always reminds me of a tracker. :oops:
Kind regardz,

Joz
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1 Falcon 030, FPU, 14 MB RAM, 2 Gb SD card
2 x Mega STe, TOS 2.06, 4 Mb RAM, 30 Mb harddisk
1 STe, TOS 2.06 (replaces older TOS), 4 Mb RAM
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby chrisadam » Mon Aug 30, 2010 8:33 am

Deployment starts after the code is appropriately tested, is approved for release and sold or otherwise distributed into a production environment.
Software Training and Support is important and a lot of developers fail to realize that. It would not matter how much time and planning a development team puts into creating software if nobody in an organization ends up using it. People are often resistant to change and avoid venturing into an unfamiliar area, so as a part of the deployment phase, it is very important to have training classes for new clients of your software.

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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby lordgiffnock » Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:56 am

Roni music's sweetsixteen midi seqencer is identical to notator and works great on any windows pc including windows 7. I've been using it for years and am amazed by the lack of info about it.
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby mal7921 » Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:45 am

lordgiffnock wrote:Roni music's sweetsixteen midi seqencer is identical to notator and works great on any windows pc including windows 7. I've been using it for years and am amazed by the lack of info about it.


Well despite the site having Atari in the name, info about it could be posted here, after all we're open to all types of music on all types of platform.

Something for us all to think about :)
The collection:

Atari 260ST, 520ST, 520ST+, 520STfm, STacy, Mega ST2
Atari STe, Mega STE, ST Book
Atari TT030, with 2GB Hard drive
Atari Falcon, 14MB, 40GB IDE drive
Atari Megafile 44

The website and the Atari bit
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Re: Anyhthing like Creator/Notator for PC?

Postby atarisince1989 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:00 am

On the early days of PCs (I think I had a 386) I used Cakewalk Pro for a while. It was the software I found more similar to Cubase. They even released a version that alowed you to use audio tracks, but as I always use MIDI, I never tried it.
My toys:
- Atari 520 STE 4MB RAM TOS 2.06 + UltraSatan
- Atari Falcon030 (running SpareMiNT+TeraDesk) 14MB RAM TOS 4.04 + 4GB Microdrive & external CF slot + NVRAM mod + SCSI buffer clock mod + EtherNEC
- Amstrad CPC 6128 + HxC USB Floppy Emulator
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